A tense exchange unfolded on Piers Morgan’s show as YusufTuggar, minister of foreign affairs, traded barbs with Goldie Ghamari, formerCanadian member of parliament, over allegations of Christian persecution inNigeria. Tuggar appeared on the show, which aired Tuesday, tochallenge the claims, clarify figures, provide context, and address Nigeria’scomplex security challenge. In the first 16 minutes of the interview, Morgan presentedfigures from the International Society for Civil Liberties and Rule of Law(Intersociety) claiming over 50,000 Christians have been killed in Nigeriasince 2009 and 18,000 churches destroyed. Tuggar dismissed the figures as inaccurate and challengedthe religious framing, saying the government does not tally deaths by faith andviews all victims as Nigerians first. When pressed for numbers, the minister went on to claim thatonly 177 Christians were killed and 102 churches attacked in the last fiveyears in Nigeria. The temperature went up a few celsius when Morgan brought inGhamari as a second guest. The Canadian politician and talk-show host alleged thatNigeria’s insecurity is a form of jihad, drawing a nexus with the October 7,2023 Hamas attack on Israel. She also cited the shared Islamic faith of President BolaTinubu and Vice-President Kashim Shettima as “evidence” of a complicit Islamistgovernment in the insecurity miasma. “By the way, this is a government that is working closelybehind the scenes with the Islamic Republic of Iran. You should ask the foreignminister why Nigerian school children are holding pictures of the Ayatollah whois a brutal dictator and is murdering my people in Iran,” she said. “People need to look into the linkages between the currentNigerian government and the Islamic Republic of Iran. “I was a politician for seven years, Piers, and I can tellwhen someone is lying and avoiding the truth. That’s exactly what this foreignminister is doing and shame on him for lying.” ‘YOU ARE A DISGRACE TO CANADA’ Tuggar called Ghamari’s comments a display of ignorance anddismissed her speech as waffling. He accused the former Canadian MP of sitting far away andtreating the lives of Nigerians like a game. On Tinubu and Shettima’s faith, the minister said Nigeriansare more concerned with regional balance than religion. Tinubu is from thesouthern region while Shettima hails from the north. Asked by Morgan if he condemned the attack on Christians byIslamist militants, Tuggar replied in the affirmative. “I lost my father-in-law to an attack by an Islamicterrorist group, Boko Haram, so I myself I’m a victim. I’ve lost family membersto attacks and they were Muslims,” the minister said. “But it doesn’t matter whether they’re Muslim or Christianbecause their aim is to kill, to maim, so that they would achieve theirobjectives. And the number one enemy of Boko Haram is not a Christian. It is aMuslim who does not subscribe to their own brand of Islam.” Morgan turned to Ghamari with the minister’s submission fora response. The politician said the killing of Muslims does not “negate thefact that there is a targeted ethnic cleansing of Christians in Nigeria”. “People like her trade in starting wars in far away placeswhere they have no contact, they have no understanding of, and they can do thatfrom their armchairs from a safe distance. It’s a real life situation,” Tuggarsaid of Ghamari in response. “This lady would not know the difference between a Fulaniman, a Tiv man, an Igbo man if they stood in front of her. “But you can see clearly overnight because it pays. She’sprobably making money out of it. She is out there trying to start a war. “They want to break up Nigeria the same way they broke upSudan and now they’ve run away. She’s not talking about Sudan anymore. She’snot talking about South Sudan. I bet she was one of those that was agitatingfor Sudan to be dismembered. “This is what they do. This is what they try to do toAfrica. Nigeria is the largest country on the African continent. It is thelargest shock absorber to the African continent in terms of admitting migrants,in terms of freedom of religion. It’s Africa’s largest democracy. “But people like you who don’t really care about freedoms,about the freedoms of either Christians or Muslims or Africans will continue toagitate for the break up of Nigeria for war the same way that it’s happening inSouth Sudan and you’ve kept mum because you’ve moved on. “You don’t care about the loss of lives. For you, it’s justanother black country to be broken up. You don’t care who dies. “It’s not going to happen to Nigeria. Move on to your nextproject. You’re a disgrace. You’re a disgrace to the Canadian nation. I’mshocked that you say that you actually practice as a politician in Canada. Moveon to the next episode. Leave us alone.” Morgan ended the interview shortly afterwards.
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